Watching Devil's Advocate again last night reminded me of an insight i had into the Whole God-Satan thing.
Accepted mythology is that Lucifer, the Best Angel, rebelled against God - started a holy war and was cast out of heaven (by Jesus if you read Paradise Lost) and into Hell and became the central force for evil on earth. Evil for man to prove himself against...
Most of what I have read on the subject says Lucifer was innately rebellious.
But, what if he wasn't? Here's the missing conversation (takes place before Lucifer's rebellion)
God: Lucifer, my best, most talented and trusted angel, I have a huge task for you.
Lucifer; Yes God whatever it is , how can I be of service?
G: Well, I've created this dualistic universe and I need a "god" to play the role of evil to my good.
L: Okay....(seeing where this is going)
G: This god will be reviled and feared and hated for all eternity. He will be separate and at odds with me. I need my best, most talented and trusted angel to do this. I am asking you.
Now this is where it gets a bit fuzzy. Lucifer agreed to do it...by starting the rebellion! His rebellion was not against God as such, it was against what God was asking him to do - what he was being banished to do. So, his "No I don't want to do that" became the basis of the energy that allowed him to be Satan.
AND, he ends up doing gods will anyway by "resisting/rebelling against" god's will.
How perfect is that?
But, it's all God's will, right, so there was really no choice involved.
I like to think the Intense Anger and Rebellion of Lucifer was fed by his unwillingness to play the role and this intense unwillingness became the basis for Satan's Evil and hatred and Rebellion.
Anyway, a different take on the story.
11 comments:
I like that shift of thought on the take of God and Satan. It's a nice dream to see, in fact, I think it's probably "better" than anything else that I've heard in regards to it.
It still mystifies me though that even with those stories going on there is still something that god and satan would of been created, manifested from the whole, whatever that is or wherever it comes from, that they do not separate what is.
the serpent speaks
The serpent: him fast sleeping
...Fearless unfear'd he slept...
- John Milton, Paradise Lost
I went to sleep
Dreaming of Love
On the cool grass
In the warm night
And awoke to
Kicks
And screams
And punishment
Because Someone else
Was led astray
And the Tempter looked like
Me.
How would you like to go to sleep
Loved and loving
Cousins to Dragons
Quetzalcoatl's Godchild
A graceful, gleaming Serpent
And wake up merely a Snake in the Grass?
I'm tired of living in
Rocky ravines
And craggy crevices
And cold holes.
I am not
Cold and slimy;
I don't wriggle and squirm.
I am
Cool and dry,
Supple and arch.
I am slandered by
The Father of Lies
Lord of the Flies
That old snake in the grass.
It still mystifies me though that even with those stories going on there is still something that god and satan would of been created, manifested from the whole, whatever that is or wherever it comes from, that they do not separate what is.
--- Not sure what you are saying here.
Kitty,
Paradise Lost was quite the story and feat of writing. The part where the actual battle occurs in heaven and the description of angles pulling up an hurling whole chunks of the ground and heaven at each other, Jesus coming to battle looking so terrifying that Lucifer and his ilk literally tear a hole in heaven and plunge through...wow
Or the little angel who throws a bolt at Lucifer, knocking him back on his ass when he disses Jesus. Magnificent verse. HARD to read...but quite the work.
Paradise Lost was one of those places/times that shifted the tectonic plates of my mind. :-D
That however God and Satan came to be, there is still something else which they were manifested from, so where is this coming from or have they just been thought and concept all along, merely playing their divine comedy roll?
I think what I might be saying (i don't even fully know if i'm expressing it correctly) but neither one never existed other than out of thought, that whatever IS, encompasses even god and satan, and would this be, for lack of a better word, truly God (Awareness, Consciousness, Truth).
LiberatedSelf, it can take my husband and me weeks trying to find words to wrap around ineffable concepts. Sometimes we're doing well to get a thought clearly conveyed in a day.
This bit from the Tao Te Ching came to mind when I read your comment:
David Hinton translation:
the named is mother to the ten thousand things,
but the unnamed is the origin to all heaven and earth.
Stephen Mitchell says :
The unnamable is the eternally real.
Naming is the origin
of all particular things.
Victor Mair:
The nameless is the origin of the myriad creatures.
The named is the mother of the myriad creatures.
Stephen Addiss and Stanley Lombardo:
Nameless: the origin of heaven and earth.
Naming: the mother of ten thousand things.
Thomas Cleary:
Nonbeing is called the beginning of heaven and earth;
being is called the mother of all things.
Waldo Japussy:
Meow is the beginning of all things,
The source of everything I want.
LiberatedSelf - I would agree - IT encompasses all. Awareness must precede even god and satan
so it's serene reflection that is the origin of the nameless (wu-wei) since the nameless and wu-wei (tao) (zen) whatever you want to call it are not separate.
To name, is to be misunderstood, which is why Osho says that the Buddha will be misunderstood because he is doing such an impossible task to begin with trying to part words which cannot explain what is. mm. :)
thanks for the post joe, and the collection of information kitty! =]
Libself,
This is nit-picking, but I would not say that serene reflection is the Origin, even if it seems that way. Perhaps serene reflection is required to let the truth come through the filters of the mind.
To name, is to be misunderstood,
Yes, adding *anything* onto the experience for Pure Reality. Even "wow" or "that's beautiful" or even noticing that you are noticing...has added a layer of separation between Pure Reality and...the entity that appears to be you . Remove even this last bit.
We do not get to know that we are experiencing pure reality. We can know "after" but not during.
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